King George-Ascot Saturday
- Chris van Buuren
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Re: Re: King George-Ascot Saturday
14 years 11 months ago
That was unbelievable....New course record.
You can get EVENS for the Arc, a bit short in my mind!
You can get EVENS for the Arc, a bit short in my mind!
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- Dave Scott
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Re: Re: King George-Ascot Saturday
14 years 11 months ago
Must say the Derby form now history but that was magic always great to have a new champ, good call Bob
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Re: Re: King George-Ascot Saturday
14 years 11 months ago
Harbinger annihilates King George rivals
Report: Ascot, Saturday
King George VI and Queen Elizabeth Stakes (Group 1) 1m4f, 3yo+
HARBINGER absolutely annihilated his King George rivals with a memorable victory in the midsummer showpiece at Ascot.
The Hardwicke Stakes winner reeled off a four-timer in scintillating style, travelling into the race supremely well for French jockey Olivier Peslier before blasting clear to post an 11-length romp in a course-record time of 2m 26.78s.
The 4-1 shot gave trainer Sir Michael Stoute back-to-back King George victories, with Cape Blanco a street back in second and Derby winner Workforce, sent offthe 8-11 favourite, a big disappointment in finishing second-last.
William Hill cut Harbinger to even-money (from 8-1) for the Prix de l'Arc de Triomphe, although Coral go a top-priced 2-1 (from 10-1).
An emotionalHarry Herbert, spokesman for winning owners Highclere Thoroughbred Racing, said: "This is the best moment of my life - bar Motivator winning the Derby - but this is Highclere. It's the blue silks.
"I'd advise anyone to get into owning race horses, it reduces grown men to tears.
"It's such an ambition for everyone, for the stable hands, for Michael [Stoute], for all my team at Highclere, and for all the owners who put in so much money."
Stoute saddled half the six-runner field in the quest for his fifth King George and, as expected, Confront assumed his pace-setting duties.
Cape Blanco and Workforce, first and second in the Totesport Dante Stakes earlier in the season, travelled side-by-side, three lengths off the pace, with Harbinger tracking in behind and Daryakana and Youmzain in arrears.
The orderbarely changed as the runners swung for home, but as push came to shove for the front trio, Peslier had barely moved a muscle on Harbinger, who was cruising into contention in striking fashion.
Harbinger with Olivier Peslier after winning the King George VI and Queen Elizabeth Stakes Ascot 24.07.2010
As soon as Peslier let Harbinger go three furlongs from home, the contest was over in the blink of an eye and the gap back to the rest of the field increased all the way to the line.
Peslier, third on the Stoute-trained Ask in this race last year, said: "You feel like you've won at the one furlong marker. The horse is the king today! I know he is good, but he was so well today. He travelled so well."
Stoute added: "He just cantered and travelled so well. He was a decent three-year-old. He was very impressive in winning the Gorden, had a blip in the Voltigeur but bounced back in the John Porter."
And, with a knowing smile on his face, he admitted: "The Arc will be considered."
Aidan O'Brien, trainer of runner-up Cape Blanco, said: "We were delighted with him. He ran a great race and showed great heart, running all the way to the line.
"People wanted to see the two Derby winners here and they went together stride by stride. I wouldn't know yet where he would go next, but this horse wouldn't mind being stepped back in trip, so he might go back to York for the International [on August 17]."
Mick Channon, trainer of third place Youmzain, said: "He has run his race again and we're delighted. On that ground he has run a cracker and we'll probably go straight to the Arc now.
"The winner was very impressive - no crystal ball could see that coming."
Daryakana's trainer Alain de Royer-Dupre said: "She ran a good race. There are no excuses."
Report: Ascot, Saturday
King George VI and Queen Elizabeth Stakes (Group 1) 1m4f, 3yo+
HARBINGER absolutely annihilated his King George rivals with a memorable victory in the midsummer showpiece at Ascot.
The Hardwicke Stakes winner reeled off a four-timer in scintillating style, travelling into the race supremely well for French jockey Olivier Peslier before blasting clear to post an 11-length romp in a course-record time of 2m 26.78s.
The 4-1 shot gave trainer Sir Michael Stoute back-to-back King George victories, with Cape Blanco a street back in second and Derby winner Workforce, sent offthe 8-11 favourite, a big disappointment in finishing second-last.
William Hill cut Harbinger to even-money (from 8-1) for the Prix de l'Arc de Triomphe, although Coral go a top-priced 2-1 (from 10-1).
An emotionalHarry Herbert, spokesman for winning owners Highclere Thoroughbred Racing, said: "This is the best moment of my life - bar Motivator winning the Derby - but this is Highclere. It's the blue silks.
"I'd advise anyone to get into owning race horses, it reduces grown men to tears.
"It's such an ambition for everyone, for the stable hands, for Michael [Stoute], for all my team at Highclere, and for all the owners who put in so much money."
Stoute saddled half the six-runner field in the quest for his fifth King George and, as expected, Confront assumed his pace-setting duties.
Cape Blanco and Workforce, first and second in the Totesport Dante Stakes earlier in the season, travelled side-by-side, three lengths off the pace, with Harbinger tracking in behind and Daryakana and Youmzain in arrears.
The orderbarely changed as the runners swung for home, but as push came to shove for the front trio, Peslier had barely moved a muscle on Harbinger, who was cruising into contention in striking fashion.
Harbinger with Olivier Peslier after winning the King George VI and Queen Elizabeth Stakes Ascot 24.07.2010
As soon as Peslier let Harbinger go three furlongs from home, the contest was over in the blink of an eye and the gap back to the rest of the field increased all the way to the line.
Peslier, third on the Stoute-trained Ask in this race last year, said: "You feel like you've won at the one furlong marker. The horse is the king today! I know he is good, but he was so well today. He travelled so well."
Stoute added: "He just cantered and travelled so well. He was a decent three-year-old. He was very impressive in winning the Gorden, had a blip in the Voltigeur but bounced back in the John Porter."
And, with a knowing smile on his face, he admitted: "The Arc will be considered."
Aidan O'Brien, trainer of runner-up Cape Blanco, said: "We were delighted with him. He ran a great race and showed great heart, running all the way to the line.
"People wanted to see the two Derby winners here and they went together stride by stride. I wouldn't know yet where he would go next, but this horse wouldn't mind being stepped back in trip, so he might go back to York for the International [on August 17]."
Mick Channon, trainer of third place Youmzain, said: "He has run his race again and we're delighted. On that ground he has run a cracker and we'll probably go straight to the Arc now.
"The winner was very impressive - no crystal ball could see that coming."
Daryakana's trainer Alain de Royer-Dupre said: "She ran a good race. There are no excuses."
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- magiclips
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Re: Re: King George-Ascot Saturday
14 years 10 months ago
I guess it's stating the obvious to describe that as the performance of the European season so far.(
It was interesting to hear the UK studio presenter mention before the race that Workforce has the habit of hanging badly left and that he could therefore be suspect on a right-handed track. Whether that had anything to do with his dismal performance I don't know, but apparently Ryan Moore was worried about it enough to get Frankie Dettori to mention it in some interview or other. If true, the Arc would appear to not be the ideal target for Workforce, with options for him at left-handed courses like York, Leopardstown and Doncaster still available - although it probably will be snowing in Durban in February before an Epsom Derby winner runs in the St Leger again. There's also the Breeders' Cup, of course, at Churchill Downs this year.
Take nothing away from Harbinger, though. The way he was cruising behind the leaders in a very fast-run race when everything else was rapidly coming off the bit even before they turned for home was astonishing.:)o

It was interesting to hear the UK studio presenter mention before the race that Workforce has the habit of hanging badly left and that he could therefore be suspect on a right-handed track. Whether that had anything to do with his dismal performance I don't know, but apparently Ryan Moore was worried about it enough to get Frankie Dettori to mention it in some interview or other. If true, the Arc would appear to not be the ideal target for Workforce, with options for him at left-handed courses like York, Leopardstown and Doncaster still available - although it probably will be snowing in Durban in February before an Epsom Derby winner runs in the St Leger again. There's also the Breeders' Cup, of course, at Churchill Downs this year.
Take nothing away from Harbinger, though. The way he was cruising behind the leaders in a very fast-run race when everything else was rapidly coming off the bit even before they turned for home was astonishing.:)o
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Re: Re: King George-Ascot Saturday
14 years 10 months ago
Morning Magic and yes a fantastic win and should prove very hard to beat if he goes for the ARC, the 3 year old crop now looks very suspect this year.
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Re: Re: King George-Ascot Saturday
14 years 10 months ago
What rating does he get taking Youmzain as the line horse (

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- magiclips
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Re: Re: King George-Ascot Saturday
14 years 10 months ago
I don't know, Hib, I'd have to check the numbers, but Youmzain was born to be a line horse. Always runs well in big races, never wins them. The sort of horse that would give our handicappers dreams of a somehat, ahem, erotic nature.
<

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Re: Re: King George-Ascot Saturday
14 years 10 months ago
This is how highly rated the race was.
Harbinger on top of the world after Ascot romp
WORLD CLASS: an analysis of the best performances of last week according to Racing Post Ratings
HARBINGER produced an epic display in the King George, propelling himself clearly into the world number one spot, but after such an unbelievable performance the pertinent question is: will he ever back it up?
It is not often that a spare ride results in a world leader, but that was the fortune bestowed on Olivier Peslier on Saturday, as his mount charged clear for an impressive 11-length success over two Derby winners, securing a record time, a record winning margin and a huge RPR of 135.
But, while the son of Dansili has looked incredibly progressive so far this season, there is a precedent to suggest that he has now peaked and this subject should be of paramount interest to those looking to take short prices about Sir Michael Stoute's charge for the Arc.
It would not be the first time a horse has peaked for the King George and never repeated the feat, as a look back at recent winners will prove.
And to broaden the matter further, it would not be the first time a horse has peaked in summer and had his form trail off by mid-autumn.
Anyone who follows racing day to day knows that almost every horse has a peak two or three months every season, and most are susceptible to an abrupt change (for better or worse) in their track performances around September when the weather cools.
This, and other factors, help to contribute to the now common occurrence of horses winning the King George in breathtaking style before disappointing in the Arc, something which Stoute will be desperately trying to avoid with his new world leader.
Six of the last nine King George winners never won again, while ten of the last 14 failed to ever repeat to the same level they achieved when winning the 1m4f summer showpiece.
The reasons the King George may be particularly partial to subsequent underperformance include the fact that many horses are trained to peak for that race, while the European pattern calendar may also take some of the blame, as there is no obvious middle-distance target between Ascot and Longchamp, which is two-and-a-half months later.
Ascot's unique nature may also have something to do with it, as the royal venue has gathered its fair share of course specialists down the years, including Doyen, who posted RPRs of 129 and 131 in the Hardwicke and King George in the hot summer of 2004, but failed to run above 121 on any start either before or since.
Swain is another example of a horse who saved his best for Ascot in summer, posting RPRs of 133 and 131 for his King George victories, but running consistently around the mid-120s for the rest of his career.
Such precedence may suggest that the King George winners tend to be overrated, but the form always stands up (something which will probably be true of Saturday's winner) and the inclination is to go with the 'autumn regression' theory.
This is not to belittle what Harbinger achieved on the weekend – it was simply stunning – but rather to temper end-of-season expectations to more realistic levels.
If the Arc was in three weeks time, at Ascot, then even-money would be a fair price for a Harbinger victory – even if Fame And Glory and the French boys turned up – but the race is not in three weeks time and, importantly, it is not at Ascot.
Using Doyen as aprime example, it might just be that Harbinger loves Ascot and is in the form of his life, but neither of those elements will help him in the Arc in October, just as it has not helped many previous King George winners who finished out of the frame in France (Conduit, Duke Of Marmalade, Montjeu, Daylami, Pentire).
Having posted a higher RPR than any of his predecessors, he at least starts his potential decline from a higher peak, offering hope that he may be one of the rare occurrences of a horse able to maintain his advantage through to October – even if he drops to a level of, say, 128, it may still be enough to win the Arc.
But, for a colt who has been on the go since April, the chances are that the bookies will pocket as much off his hype as they did off his stablemate Workforce on the weekend.
The problem in both cases is that a performance figure is not a promise that a horse will ever repeat a certain level. It is merely an indication of what the horse achieved under a specific set of circumstances.
When you change the time of year, the track, the way the race is run, the current form of the horse/yard/jockey and the going, you drastically change what the horse is capable of.
Some horses, like Sea The Stars, are not affected by the many variables, and it is that flexibility and consistency which really defined his legacy – as opposed tojudging him on one stand out performance.
In Harbinger's case, so far, the opposite is true – he has posted two stellar performances over the same course and distance one month apart and he is being judged on his peak performance.
His test will come when the variables change and there is absolutely no guarantee he will repeat his magnificent King George romp – indeed it is highly unlikely. How can he possibly follow that?
If this turns out to be an unrepeated, course-specialist performance, his win could be scaled back to around the 133/4 mark, while if he were to follow it up and the form were to receive boosts elsewhere, the best possible view (taking a straight line through the second and fourth) could see this go as high as 140.
This was the first top-level clash of the generations this season, thus making the form hard to pin down precisely, but in dispatching the Epsom and Irish Derby winners with such ease,and by pulling so far clear in such a fast time, this was clearly the performance of a legitimate world leader.
Whatever happens to the form, this display was so special it is likely to see him top the world standings at the end of the year.
It can not be stressed enough, however, that this rating is not a guarantee of future success and it will be an awful lot harder than a simple case of 'repeat will suffice' for Harbinger when and if he rocks up against the French sophomores in the Arc.
Harbinger currently leads the world by a whopping 5lb from dirt leader Quality Road (130) on RPRs.
TOP OF THE CLASS: Harbinger 135
Trainer: Sir Michael Stoute (GB)
King George, Ascot, 1m4f, July 24
OVERALL WORLD TOP TEN
1. Harbinger (GB) King George 135T
2. Quality Road (US)
Metropolitan Handicap 130D
3. Workforce (GB)
Epsom Derby 129T
4. Paco Boy (GB)
Queen Anne
128T
5. Fame And Glory (IRE)
Coronation Cup 127T
6. Byword (FR) Prix D'Ispahan 126T
Canford Cliffs (GB) Irish 2,000 Guineas
126T
Goldikova (FR)
Queen Anne
126T
9. Starspangledbanner (IRE)
Golden Jubilee/July Cup
125T
10. Behkabad (FR)
Grand Prix de Paris 124T
Dick Turpin (GB)
Prix Jean Prat 124T
Equiano (GB) July Cup
124T
Kinsale King (US)
Golden Shaheen
124A
Lope De Vega (FR) Prix du Jockey Club 124T
Rachel Alexandra (US) Fleur De Lis Handicap 124D
Super Saver (US) Kentucky Derby 124D
Zenyatta (US)
Santa Margarita Invitational 124A
D = dirt, A = all-weather, T = turf
TOP DIRT PERFORMERS
1. Quality Road (US) Metropolitan Handicap
130
2. Rachel Alexandra (US)
Fleur De LisHandicap 124
Super Saver (US)
Kentucky Derby 124
4. Eskendereya (US) Fountain Of Youth 123
Espoir City (JAP)
February Stakes
123
Zenyatta (US)
Apple Blossom 123
7. Blame (US)
Stephen Foster Handicap 122
8. Lookin At Lucky (US)
Preakness 121
9. Battle Plan (US)
Stephen Foster Handicap 120
Big Drama (US)
Smile Sprint 120
Blind Luck (US)
Kentucky Oaks 120
Musket Man (US) Carter Handicap 120
TOP TURF PERFORMERS
1. Harbinger (GB)
King George 135
2. Workforce (GB)
Epsom Derby 129
3. Paco Boy (GB)
Queen Anne 128
4. Fame And Glory (IRE)
Coronation Cup 127
5. Byword (FR)
Prix D'Ispahan 126
Canford Cliffs (GB)
Irish 2,000 Guineas
126
Goldikova (FR) Queen Anne 126
8. Starspangledbanner (IRE) Golden Jubilee/July Cup 125
9. Behkabad (FR) Grand Prix de Paris 124
Dick Turpin (GB)
Prix Jean Prat 124
Equiano (GB) July Cup 124
Lope De Vega (FR) Prix du Jockey Club
124
TOP ALL-WEATHER PERFORMERS
1. Kinsale King (US)
GoldenShaheen 124
Zenyatta (US) Santa Margarita Invitational 124
3. Bob Black Jack (US)
San Carlos Handicap
122
Gloria De Campeao (FR) Dubai World Cup
122
Lizard's Desire (SA) Dubai World Cup 122
Musir (SA)
UAE Derby 122
Rail Trip (US)
Hollywood Gold Cup
122
Rocket Man (SIN) Goldene Shaheen 122
9. Allybar (UAE) Dubai World Cup
121
Misremembered (US)
Santa Anita Handicap 121
Neko Bay (US)
Santa Anita Handicap 121
Harbinger on top of the world after Ascot romp
WORLD CLASS: an analysis of the best performances of last week according to Racing Post Ratings
HARBINGER produced an epic display in the King George, propelling himself clearly into the world number one spot, but after such an unbelievable performance the pertinent question is: will he ever back it up?
It is not often that a spare ride results in a world leader, but that was the fortune bestowed on Olivier Peslier on Saturday, as his mount charged clear for an impressive 11-length success over two Derby winners, securing a record time, a record winning margin and a huge RPR of 135.
But, while the son of Dansili has looked incredibly progressive so far this season, there is a precedent to suggest that he has now peaked and this subject should be of paramount interest to those looking to take short prices about Sir Michael Stoute's charge for the Arc.
It would not be the first time a horse has peaked for the King George and never repeated the feat, as a look back at recent winners will prove.
And to broaden the matter further, it would not be the first time a horse has peaked in summer and had his form trail off by mid-autumn.
Anyone who follows racing day to day knows that almost every horse has a peak two or three months every season, and most are susceptible to an abrupt change (for better or worse) in their track performances around September when the weather cools.
This, and other factors, help to contribute to the now common occurrence of horses winning the King George in breathtaking style before disappointing in the Arc, something which Stoute will be desperately trying to avoid with his new world leader.
Six of the last nine King George winners never won again, while ten of the last 14 failed to ever repeat to the same level they achieved when winning the 1m4f summer showpiece.
The reasons the King George may be particularly partial to subsequent underperformance include the fact that many horses are trained to peak for that race, while the European pattern calendar may also take some of the blame, as there is no obvious middle-distance target between Ascot and Longchamp, which is two-and-a-half months later.
Ascot's unique nature may also have something to do with it, as the royal venue has gathered its fair share of course specialists down the years, including Doyen, who posted RPRs of 129 and 131 in the Hardwicke and King George in the hot summer of 2004, but failed to run above 121 on any start either before or since.
Swain is another example of a horse who saved his best for Ascot in summer, posting RPRs of 133 and 131 for his King George victories, but running consistently around the mid-120s for the rest of his career.
Such precedence may suggest that the King George winners tend to be overrated, but the form always stands up (something which will probably be true of Saturday's winner) and the inclination is to go with the 'autumn regression' theory.
This is not to belittle what Harbinger achieved on the weekend – it was simply stunning – but rather to temper end-of-season expectations to more realistic levels.
If the Arc was in three weeks time, at Ascot, then even-money would be a fair price for a Harbinger victory – even if Fame And Glory and the French boys turned up – but the race is not in three weeks time and, importantly, it is not at Ascot.
Using Doyen as aprime example, it might just be that Harbinger loves Ascot and is in the form of his life, but neither of those elements will help him in the Arc in October, just as it has not helped many previous King George winners who finished out of the frame in France (Conduit, Duke Of Marmalade, Montjeu, Daylami, Pentire).
Having posted a higher RPR than any of his predecessors, he at least starts his potential decline from a higher peak, offering hope that he may be one of the rare occurrences of a horse able to maintain his advantage through to October – even if he drops to a level of, say, 128, it may still be enough to win the Arc.
But, for a colt who has been on the go since April, the chances are that the bookies will pocket as much off his hype as they did off his stablemate Workforce on the weekend.
The problem in both cases is that a performance figure is not a promise that a horse will ever repeat a certain level. It is merely an indication of what the horse achieved under a specific set of circumstances.
When you change the time of year, the track, the way the race is run, the current form of the horse/yard/jockey and the going, you drastically change what the horse is capable of.
Some horses, like Sea The Stars, are not affected by the many variables, and it is that flexibility and consistency which really defined his legacy – as opposed tojudging him on one stand out performance.
In Harbinger's case, so far, the opposite is true – he has posted two stellar performances over the same course and distance one month apart and he is being judged on his peak performance.
His test will come when the variables change and there is absolutely no guarantee he will repeat his magnificent King George romp – indeed it is highly unlikely. How can he possibly follow that?
If this turns out to be an unrepeated, course-specialist performance, his win could be scaled back to around the 133/4 mark, while if he were to follow it up and the form were to receive boosts elsewhere, the best possible view (taking a straight line through the second and fourth) could see this go as high as 140.
This was the first top-level clash of the generations this season, thus making the form hard to pin down precisely, but in dispatching the Epsom and Irish Derby winners with such ease,and by pulling so far clear in such a fast time, this was clearly the performance of a legitimate world leader.
Whatever happens to the form, this display was so special it is likely to see him top the world standings at the end of the year.
It can not be stressed enough, however, that this rating is not a guarantee of future success and it will be an awful lot harder than a simple case of 'repeat will suffice' for Harbinger when and if he rocks up against the French sophomores in the Arc.
Harbinger currently leads the world by a whopping 5lb from dirt leader Quality Road (130) on RPRs.
TOP OF THE CLASS: Harbinger 135
Trainer: Sir Michael Stoute (GB)
King George, Ascot, 1m4f, July 24
OVERALL WORLD TOP TEN
1. Harbinger (GB) King George 135T
2. Quality Road (US)
Metropolitan Handicap 130D
3. Workforce (GB)
Epsom Derby 129T
4. Paco Boy (GB)
Queen Anne
128T
5. Fame And Glory (IRE)
Coronation Cup 127T
6. Byword (FR) Prix D'Ispahan 126T
Canford Cliffs (GB) Irish 2,000 Guineas
126T
Goldikova (FR)
Queen Anne
126T
9. Starspangledbanner (IRE)
Golden Jubilee/July Cup
125T
10. Behkabad (FR)
Grand Prix de Paris 124T
Dick Turpin (GB)
Prix Jean Prat 124T
Equiano (GB) July Cup
124T
Kinsale King (US)
Golden Shaheen
124A
Lope De Vega (FR) Prix du Jockey Club 124T
Rachel Alexandra (US) Fleur De Lis Handicap 124D
Super Saver (US) Kentucky Derby 124D
Zenyatta (US)
Santa Margarita Invitational 124A
D = dirt, A = all-weather, T = turf
TOP DIRT PERFORMERS
1. Quality Road (US) Metropolitan Handicap
130
2. Rachel Alexandra (US)
Fleur De LisHandicap 124
Super Saver (US)
Kentucky Derby 124
4. Eskendereya (US) Fountain Of Youth 123
Espoir City (JAP)
February Stakes
123
Zenyatta (US)
Apple Blossom 123
7. Blame (US)
Stephen Foster Handicap 122
8. Lookin At Lucky (US)
Preakness 121
9. Battle Plan (US)
Stephen Foster Handicap 120
Big Drama (US)
Smile Sprint 120
Blind Luck (US)
Kentucky Oaks 120
Musket Man (US) Carter Handicap 120
TOP TURF PERFORMERS
1. Harbinger (GB)
King George 135
2. Workforce (GB)
Epsom Derby 129
3. Paco Boy (GB)
Queen Anne 128
4. Fame And Glory (IRE)
Coronation Cup 127
5. Byword (FR)
Prix D'Ispahan 126
Canford Cliffs (GB)
Irish 2,000 Guineas
126
Goldikova (FR) Queen Anne 126
8. Starspangledbanner (IRE) Golden Jubilee/July Cup 125
9. Behkabad (FR) Grand Prix de Paris 124
Dick Turpin (GB)
Prix Jean Prat 124
Equiano (GB) July Cup 124
Lope De Vega (FR) Prix du Jockey Club
124
TOP ALL-WEATHER PERFORMERS
1. Kinsale King (US)
GoldenShaheen 124
Zenyatta (US) Santa Margarita Invitational 124
3. Bob Black Jack (US)
San Carlos Handicap
122
Gloria De Campeao (FR) Dubai World Cup
122
Lizard's Desire (SA) Dubai World Cup 122
Musir (SA)
UAE Derby 122
Rail Trip (US)
Hollywood Gold Cup
122
Rocket Man (SIN) Goldene Shaheen 122
9. Allybar (UAE) Dubai World Cup
121
Misremembered (US)
Santa Anita Handicap 121
Neko Bay (US)
Santa Anita Handicap 121
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Re: Re: King George-Ascot Saturday
14 years 10 months ago
Suffered an injury this morning,could be career threatening
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Re: Re: King George-Ascot Saturday
14 years 10 months ago
Must be heart breaking for the connections
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