Bookies with sense and those insensible.

russelldavie Wrote:

---

> Yes I am a punter, and I'll give you some advise.
> Stay away from odds on favourites in juvenile
> races.

Russell

Generally speaking that is good advise. However not in this case. MS would never have lost that race.

well done to the bookies that refunded the stakes,but you must remember that the bookies must follow the rules of racing,so dont blame them for not refunding losing bets..


The result should never have stood,the horse probably should never have been reloaded,stipes starters and the nha should be taken to task on this matter and not bookies/tote

russelldavie Wrote:

---

> Like I've said before, make a list of all the
> bookies that gave refunds well done to them.But
> don't have a go at the guys that couldn't. We
> don't know what is going on in there books. They
> might have taken the horse back on interbet and
> stand to loose a fortune for nothing that they
> did. They might of really wanted to pay a refund
> to there smaller clients but didn't want to do
> the same for there bigger clients.
>
> Like I've said before, I don't think it's fair to
> have a go at the bookmakers who didn't refund.

But you claimed they were well established... So if they not mentioned here then there's no problem surely. Their books wouldn't be a problem if they are well established. It all depends what's more important to the bookie, 5 years of punting loyalty or 1 horse race, sorry bud but it's a dog eat dog world out there and we all need to weigh up the consequences.

Well Done to Hollywod who paid my bet as a Double "Its My Brother , Storm dancer and My Sanctuary" while i appreciatte they had no obligation to pay me out, but i feel so good that a Bookmaker has done this gesture. he not only won my support but i will canvass for more patrons to join Hollywood.

I don't care how big or small the bookmaker is, I have never seen anything like this in bookmaking where the punter EXPECTS to be paid his full amount on the winner and a refund on the favourite. It must be a crazy time to be a bookmaker.

hibernia Wrote:

---

> well done to the bookies that refunded the
> stakes,but you must remember that the bookies must
> follow the rules of racing,so dont blame them for
> not refunding losing bets..
>
>
> The result should never have stood,the horse
> probably should never have been reloaded,stipes
> starters and the nha should be taken to task on
> this matter and not bookies/tote

Well then I rest my case. Good punting to all, for future reference I'd suggest all do their homework as to which bookie you'd take a bet with. It's us the punters who need to make sure we seek the most ethical bookie and not the best price. But nonetheless well done to all those bookies that did refund, a big thumbs up from me anyway. As for the rules and the RA... Well I'm not going down that path cause we all know who runs that.

russelldavie Wrote:

---

> Like I've said before, make a list of all the
> bookies that gave refunds well done to them.But
> don't have a go at the guys that couldn't. We
> don't know what is going on in there books. They
> might have taken the horse back on interbet and
> stand to loose a fortune for nothing that they
> did. They might of really wanted to pay a refund
> to there smaller clients but didn't want to do
> the same for there bigger clients.
>
> Like I've said before, I don't think it's fair to
> have a go at the bookmakers who didn't refund.

I know someone that put big sums on at Wsb and they took back and lost and refunded, and so was everyone else. What happened today was unique.... things will change(i hope). Rules must be rewritten. So thats why i am standing up for Winning Post ( i dont know WP at all) here and saying to those that didn't refund. You don't deserve your customers because year in year out they support you. The punters take knocks you give them manfully year in year out. In fairness you all know what should have happened. So yes, legally you are not held to refund, but if you didn't you are unfair. If you cannot afford to take a knock for one race in the name of fairness, you don't deserve to be in the game and you don't deserve your punters. If there are any bookies who are under pressure just because of that race then I advise you to get out of the game. If that one race meant your survival in this game, get out now, don't stop , keep going! To all those that refunded, viva!

russelldavie Wrote:

---

> I don't care how big or small the bookmaker is, I
> have never seen anything like this in bookmaking
> where the punter EXPECTS to be paid his full
> amount on the winner and a refund on the
> favourite. It must be a crazy time to be a
> bookmaker.

RD I don't expect anything, it's a crazy time equally for a punter. Thanks for your input but I think punters/bookies need decide for themselves where to go from here.

YCentaur Wrote:

---

> russelldavie Wrote:
>

---

>

---

> > Like I've said before, make a list of all the
> > bookies that gave refunds well done to them.But
> > don't have a go at the guys that couldn't. We
> > don't know what is going on in there books.
> They
> > might have taken the horse back on interbet and
> > stand to loose a fortune for nothing that they
> > did. They might of really wanted to pay a
> refund
> > to there smaller clients but didn't want to do
> > the same for there bigger clients.
> >
> > Like I've said before, I don't think it's fair
> to
> > have a go at the bookmakers who didn't refund.
>
> I know someone that put big sums on at Wsb and
> they took back and lost and refunded, and so was
> everyone else. What happened today was unique....
> things will change(i hope). Rules must be
> rewritten. So thats why i am standing up for
> Winning Post ( i dont know WP at all) here and
> saying to those that didn't refund. You don't
> deserve your customers because year in year out
> they support you. The punters take knocks you give
> them manfully year in year out. In fairness you
> all know what should have happened. So yes,
> legally you are not held to refund, but if you
> didn't you are unfair. If you cannot afford to
> take a knock for one race in the name of fairness,
> you don't deserve to be in the game and you don't
> deserve your punters. If there are any bookies who
> are under pressure just because of that race then
> I advise you to get out of the game. If that one
> race meant your survival in this game, get out
> now, don't stop , keep going! To all those that
> refunded, viva!

Thankyou!! At least now I know that there are bookmakers out there willing to promote the fairness of the game. Very nicely put YC.

hibernia Wrote:

---

> The result should never have stood,the horse
> probably should never have been reloaded,stipes
> starters and the nha should be taken to task on
> this matter and not bookies/tote

I don't think the starter could have called a "false start", as
that is only for horses that are "advantaged" and not for those
"disadvantaged". The reasoning works the same as an objection,
where the transgressor is punished, and does not seek to reward
the affected horses.

Up to a few years ago we had the "rub of the green" rule where if
the starting stalls did not open properly is was just your bad luck.
Obviously the NHA have attempted to remedy this but the new
rule also has its flaws.

As I see it, everything was done according to the rules, but quite
obviously the rules need some revision. I am sure that none of the
officials set out to deliberately antagonise the punters, and that this
was just a bye-product of a poor rule.

This is not the first time poor rules have caused a riot, as it has
happened numerous times before, as I recall the Bestic race at
old Fairview and the Greek Affair race in Jo'burg just to name two.

Hi Dave
 
Please can you add this to the post:
 
To All World Sports Betting (WSB) Clients
 
A decision has been taken by the management of WSB with regards to the unfortunate incident that took place at Clairwood today.
 
WSB will refund all bets taken on My Sanctuary in Race 6. All winning bets on War Path will be paid, with no deduction.
 
Please can clients contact Mark Kinsman, by email or phone, to claim their refund on bets taken on My Sanctuary.
 
Email address is: mark@wsb.co.za
Phone number: 0860 10 33 93
 
Thanks.
 
Kind Regards,

I gather Gold Circle was/is trying to work out how/if they can pay back the bets to win/exacta's on the filly but 1 of the stumbling blocks is they cannot make a unilateral decision without their Jhb and Cape partners agreeing. Will keep you informed.