How about... Tax?

After reading that between the Tote and Bookies 8 Billion Rand is 'bet' on our industry every year.

We 'Take' our 3% (50% of the 6% Betting Tax) upfront on said revenue - NOT on winnings! Meaning EVERY one pays - whether Bookies pass there bets onto the Tote or otherwise.

The plus for the punters being if they have a nice win they have already paid the Tax on stake and thereby won't pay on increased winnings!

Overal however 'we' should get more money as losing bets far exceed winning.

What say the Clan???

Respectfully, Jim.

calling morilihochile

calling morilihochile

Que?

To clarify the above, 'we' are taking our 3% (50% cut) upfront - meaning 3% 'tax' will be owed on any winnings and will still go to the Taxman - unless of course, they too decide that taking it 'upfront' is the way to go.


Also as an aside - and in regard to the 'Tote manipulation' discussed previous.

How about, once you are on, you can't withdraw - like with a bookie.

Although you will be permitted to change to another number within the same race - in case of error.

However, for any amount above say R100 you must write your name and address on the back of the exchanged ticket - to minimise any skullduggery, as a result thereof.

Cheers guys, just a couple of ideas - Jim.

hard message to sell to the punter - we used to take 6% only when you won, now you can pay it before you even have a bet.

or your option b: we'll clip the ticket twice, 3% now and 3% later

still, might drive more of them to the tote where there is no tax...?

The Tote has a built in deduction I believe + unlike the bookies money goes directly back into stakes - no? So not as bad as you think.

Not withstanding that, you will save Tax when you do win.

Or maybe, as it was years ago in the UK - you can have the Choice of paying the tax upfront or like it is currently upon returns.

Guys, all I'm trying to do is try and find ways to get as much cash back into the industry as poss. to increase Stakes money.

Having Bookies pay an amount toward that goal - get definative payments from Global markets based on races shown / pool generated etc. All have merit, and need to be more openly disclosed so as 'we' know what is and isn't being paid at the moment. And what can be done to improve / increase revenue that is returned and put directly back into the industry.

Respectfully, Jim.

100%. the way things are structured now the more punters at the tote the better for racing.

that is not to say that the way things are is how they should be.

as a starting point, why not stipulate that bookmakers must return a minimum of 75% of turnover to players (like the tote), and bookmakers must pay 30% of their overround to stakes (like the tote) and 6% of their overround to tax (like the tote)?

then it would be genuinely bookmakers v the tote.

Isn't this still about diverting punters money to owners?

Yes - and why not?

Yes, but why?

Again, no shortage of horses or owners.

I own and sell horses so more money would be nice, but Jim, if this were a business you owned you would not be fixing anything thats broken.

Greenbook writes:
"still, might drive more of them to the tote where there is no tax...?"
Of course there is a tax. There is a deduction on all pools. I think from 18% to 25%. I stand corrected on the exact figures. The main issue I believe is the bookmakers contribution to the financial betterment of racing. At present all they contribute is a service to punters...period. The tote is the only sustainer of racing in this country and should be supported on a far greater scale than bookies.