protecting the image of racing

Strange....Matthew and I spoke yesterday, but not about my runners....
However, Matthew is welcome to call me whenever he likes if he wants to know anything. But nowadays he doesn't need to do this that often as he misses very little, due to his hard work and form studies.

Perhaps u don't go racing often enough Andy cap. ..maybe u haven't noticed that I always try and help Punters when asked, as well as replying to Tellytrack Presenters requests for info.
You see, it is a sad problem here on ABC, when we are personally criticised, simply because we also have an opinion.
Maybe that's why the "insiders" won't post here. Instead of having a go at me in order to score your Brownie points, perhaps u want to also post the names of the Trainers who do NOT EVER post on ABC.
There can be no doubt that all Trainers are better off never ever posting here.
And since our Trainers meeting of earlier today, most on ABC will be very surprised to learn which and also how many Trainers won't come near this site as they believe that we are on a hiding to nothing and that the majority of posters do nothing else but complain and point fingers.

Morning Louis and thanks again for your inputs.
ABC has always been a platform for punters, trainers and owners to voice their opinions.
It's no secret club where we have a get togethers to try and have personal attacks on individuals.
The nature of open 24/7 forums has always been a difficult challenge to manage from the initial Betfair concept and many other forums have come and gone.
We will continue to try and supply this platform and keep the balance between free speech and personal attacks.
As always many thanks to all for your numerous valuable contributions.
I appreciate it's not easy to post on the site especially for trainers as you are on a hiding to nothing but on the other hand take the example of Hollywood who show their commitment to customer care by meeting any complaints and concerns head on.

Good punting

I note with amusement the references to form study being the answer to this little dilemma and the undertone that if we worked harder on our form studying we would identify these form turnarounds. What an absolute load of codswallop. Only the inner sanctum would have known the well being of the Botes horse on the day. No amount of studying would have changed the fact that the horse, on its exposed form and more particularly its maiden run for the yard, had absolutely no chance in that field.

Perhaps someone could give us the strike rate of the Whisperer in terms of his selections? Judging by what has been said it is clearly 100% as all he does is study form. This is not an attack on the whisperer I do not know the man or have a problem with him, what I am saying is that if I, or anyone else, select outsiders in every race, at some stage we will get lucky.

ota how do you study a race

Imin I am a believer in the strength of formlines and hence am a big formgrids user.

Perhaps you could enlighten me how you found this horse in the race without knowing something. How did you have the confidence to back this horse after its Joburg debut, and being out MANY lengths on MR.

Is ABC forum not an inner circle with all the input from various informed and knowledgeable posters... when a horse is tipped and money is made do we worry about the punters in the tote who did not and could not find the winner..every race that is run we have winners and losers . [ reason why punters put fields in exotics .. the key obviously is to know when to and when not to ]

Len, I do not worry about them but they can easily read the comments on ABC can they not? Where can we read about the well-being of horses from those in the know?

Louis, I have always been grateful for your comments and your opinions on this site are often a welcome bit of open opinion in a seemingly cloak and dagger world. However, all this tripe (imho ) about being scared of ABC simply doesn't wash with me. I hear very little anti-Ramsden, Bass, Crawford comments on ABC who all make pre-race comments on websites. I don't remember PeterD coming in for abuse here or others like him. I remember the occasional anti-Sham comment but the vast majority quickly spoke out in favour of the Shams. So, who are all these open and honest owners/trainers who fear that they will be hung, drawn and quartered here???

I do think the ones who might come in for a little "abuse" are those who say their odds-on favourite has a chance and a couple of 5/2 shots have place chances but they fail to mention their 16/1 shot that is backed into 5/2 and wins by 5 lengths. Punters aren't all stupid. And the image of the game that scenario creates to someone who has just had their first betting day..?

There are a number of ways trainers/owners could keep punters informed, rather than leaving it to the last minute with a quick comment to a tv presenter, but they choose not to. Fact. If they don't want to comment on ABC that is fine but, there are other ways it can be done. Very few seem interested in finding another way. And why would that be? Honestly, I can't think of a good reason but would be all ears if people can enlighten me cos the way I see it, as I have repeatedly stated, there can be little doubt it is potentially a big step in the right direction of keeping the current punter base and possibly attracting new blood. Thus prolonging the sport. Surely that is ultimately what we all want isn't it... or are some more intent of maintaining their own self-interests?

PS Louis, I don't think anyone has intentionally had a "pop" at the Whisperer. And even he said it was a lunatic bet. Well done to him.

Englander correct we don't worry about them as they have never heard of ABC and only make up the pools .. so why must trainers or those in the inner circle worry about us .

For me, what I would like to hear are the softer things like that the horse wanted another bucket of oats for breakfast, he kicked the goat, he escaped and eloped, too damn lazy, and so on. If the horse is catching pigeons at home I am also aware that another ten horses in the race may also be catching even more pigeons and much more quickly.

I think we are way off the point of the thread....pirates asked opinion about the position of an owner on a racing body ....a legitimate question imo and whether this has been done before, or whether this is allowed in other jurisdictions, does not hold a lot of water imo.....for me I think in this particular case it does lead a slightly sour taste in the mouth ....and as is also mentioned, heaven forbid if a horse owned by an individual in such a position is involved in an objection. The handicappers (as far as I know) are not allowed to own horses, so the question is, should this restriction be applicable to other 'influential' positions as well....and this has nothing to do with the integrity of the person holding that position.

As far as 'form study' and trainer's comments go, for me trainer and jockey comments are useful in some cases ('horse is returning from a rest and probably is / is not fit enough, etc.), but in the main these comments remain 'opinions'......I'm not sure that if Mr Botes came on here to state that he thought the horse had a chance and that his last run was to be ignored, etc., that I would necessarily have taken heed of those comments (but I take the point that I would have had the choice).....as probably most other trainers if asked, would have stated confidence in their runners....that's just human nature....especially in a handicap where every horse in theory has an equal chance to win

lol Len.... because we, Toters, ABCers, Bookie goers etc have ALL heard about horses, trainers and owners and they are the ones that know if a horse is having a prep run, will need the run, is raring to go, has much improved in work of late, had a setback, got four big kicks lto, etc etc etc, we on ABC only "speculate".

Mac and Frodo... I agree, I primarily just want to know the well-being. The most useful comments to me on the websites I mentioned... "is a prep run" and/or "will be in need of the run". And yes Frodo, way off the original point and not sure quite how we got to where we are!!

Not forgetting that there was a betting coup on a horse owned by the chairman. The poor chairman possibly did not even have a cent on the horse.